I'm new to this plugin scene and wanted additional creatures. What did Telesphoros mean by adding them to the Leveled List? Could someone provide a detailed guide on what I have to do?

Thank you in advance.

Go to http://www.mwmythicmods.com/telesphoros.htm , Click the 'Tools' Button and download TES Tool 1.3. That's a utility that will merge your leveled lists. Without it you'll only be using the leveled lists from you last loaded mod, rather than combining them all.

When you use TES Tool, either click 'Just Fix It' or update the leveled lists manually. Make sure you read the README to understand what it's actually doing.

Alright lets see if I can explain this without having to give ya a few links to tools you might need. As you play MW you gain levels, which in turn govern which monsters/bad guys you encounter. So if you go to where a scrib spawns at LvL 1 you will encounter the scrib. But if you go there at say LvL 20 you will encounter a creature on par with what LvL you are. Hence the game using Level Lists to spawn creatures on par with what level you are.

Now when you download mods that add creatures hopefully the creator of said mod adds the creatures into the level lists of the game. Which again makes it where the new creatures will spawn depending on your level. A good example of this I've noticed is that when I ran around with my highest level character (LvL 29) Mw was populated with all kinds of creatures. Where as before the lands looked rather bleak and devoid of creature life....other then the every now and again Cliff Racer or scrib.

Also when you download a creature mod a good rule of thumb is to also download two tools that helps. First is TESTooL 1.3. This combines all the mods you use that use Level Lists, Objects, or Dialogs. Also you want, by use of the tool to move all the merged esps created by the tool to the bottom of the list. Now the other tool is the Level List Resequencer, which is fairly new. It seems there is some sort of problem with TesTools merging of the leveled lists. All it does is resequence the lists, nothing more. But it is a mod's life saver.

You can find each of these tools in the mod post you mentioned. Good luck with mods.

Main

Thanx a lot for the replies. =D

So basically, for whatever creature mods I have, I should load them up in TESTool and execute the Merged leveled lists function, use the Level List Resequencer and I should be fine?

Also, should I use the Fix It for all my plugins I download?

This post has been edited by NeoCarnageZX: Sep 4 2004, 01:22 AM

Definatly a better description that I could ever give. But you forgot about leveled LOOT lists. Pretty much the same thing, but the quality of the loot you find as you plow through MW increases as you increase level. So where you would normally find a bargain restore health potion, you may find a quality restore health potion or better. This goes for almost all the loot you find, be it weapons, armor, alchemical ingredients or other junk.

Not exactly.
Each mod you download should be checked for cleanliness with TesTool.
Then when you have all the mods you want to use all clean and tidy.
You enable them ( you can enable them in the Data Files section of the Morrowind Start screen or by using TesTool's Manage Plugin Option )
Now all mods clean and tidy and enabled.
You run the Dialogue Merge....that creates a new mod
You run Object merge ... That creates a second new mod
You run LevelledList Merge .... that creates a third new mod
Make sure that these three new mods are enabled
Run Levelled List Resequencer. This re-sequences the levelled lists in the merged levelled list mod that TesTool created.
Finally, using the Manage Loaded Mods option again, you make certain that these last three mods are also the last ones on the list. So that they will be the last mods loaded by the game.
If they are not the last mods, you highlight them and click the Update Time option. This will move the date stamp on these mods to be later than all other mods on the list.
Voilá all mods cleaned, all merges merged, load order correct
And now you play.
The three functions ( merge dialogue, merge objects, merge levelled lists ) operate on all ACTIVE mods at once.

This post has been edited by Iudas: Sep 4 2004, 06:10 AM

Okay, the leved list bit I understand, but what does the merge dialogue and merge object function do?

Alright thanx. Should I just use the Fix It or do them all seperately?

I answered this in another post so this is the short form answer:
Levelled Objects: MW itself is a bit of a sledge hammer when it loads objects. Mods can change subparts of objects ( I add new tires, you add a new exhaust system both to the same car ) MW will take the newest mod and that is it. Merged objects in TesTool adds your tires and my exhaust system to the default car.

Merged Dialog is approx the same idea but MW uses a different method for dialog and there are some subtleties that need to be addressed by modders and tools makers. On Balance you are better off merging dialogs and objects and levelled lists and time stamping them to be the last mods loaded..... and do use the levelled list re-sequencer....there is a fundamental error in TesTool's handling of levelled list and the resequencer is a simple way to solve the problem.
DO NOT use Horatio's List Leveller his tool has different problems and no one has developed a solution to its problems and Horatio is no longer modding in MW.

Personally I clean them each separately. ( And when I go out I wear a belt and suspenders .... so sue me I am not the world's most trusting soul )
then enable them using the Manage Loaded Mods option
Then merge dialogs
Then Merge Objects
Then Merge Levelled Lists
Then Re-Sequence the levelled lists.
Now some points:
There are some mods that should not be cleaned ( MultiMark is one )
There are some mods that should not have dialog Merged ( Vampire Embrace is one )
There are some mods that demand to be the LAST MOD LOADED ( well to hell with that, Levelled Lists is the last mod loaded usually )
If you are developing a mod for the ROTW ( that is Rest of The World ) you probably dont want ANY MODS LOADED or any Merges.
So Far there are no Mods that should not have their levelled lists merged and no mods that I am aware of that should not have their object merged.

Why is it still up for download then? Time to run TESTool now I guess, up till now I have been using Horatio's. What problems does it have exactly?

You probably can merge vampire embrace dialog. The only situation that would defenitly cause a problem would be if you merge it with a mod that also touches the vampire refusals since vampire embrace deletes them (as it has its own), so that other mod may try to reinstate them.

Unfortionately certain mods touch those vampire refusal lines unintentinately as they deal with things nearby (like Ices hideway), so you cannot merge its dialog with those.

This post has been edited by Cortex: Sep 6 2004, 08:57 AM

Two different issues have been reported with Horatio's Leveller.
1) it ignores the settings in the levelled lists for chance none
2) it has a tendency to start dropping 10 of an item into the lists instead of 1....tendency not consistent.

As for why it is still available, you would have to ask the various site masters that question.
The consensus is that use of Horatio's leveller has been deprecated and that TesTool's levelled list and then the Re-sequencer is the current best practice.

It appears that there are even more subtle ways to corrupt dialog, this thread from the old forums has the most thorough explanation of how the engine sorts dialogs that I have come across.
http://www.elderscrolls.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=2007868&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=all&vc=1

I already merged the Vampire Embrace dialog :( Do i just run testool again with vampire embrace unticked, or do i have to download Vampire Embrace again? I dont really understand if testool changes the original .esp files dialog or whatever..

Luckely I already knew not to touch the top and bottom when I started modding (as its a linked list so would lead to all manner of problems). It may even have been mentioned somewhere.

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What does TesTool do if it encounters a deleted line in one mod that is touched by another mod?

Without TesTool, preference is always given to the delete irrespective of mod date order and this serves mods that need to delete lines like vampire embrace perfectly as it means they always work even with other mods that touch the lines.
Perhaps TesTool should include that?

This post has been edited by Cortex: Sep 6 2004, 06:13 PM

If you run TesTool and tell it to CLEAN a mod, it will create a new mod with the word CLEAN attached to the mod name. VampEmbrace would become CleanVampEmbrace.
You can choose to have TesTool overwrite the original mod, or save as a separate mod or even save as a separate mod in a different directory.

If you run the Merge functions, TesTool does NOT touch the original mods, it reads data from them and uses that specific data to create 3 entirely new mods.

And specific answer to your question is YES. Just untick Vamp Embrace and then Remake the Merged Dialogs and then retick Vamp Embrace. And of course, if you have already started some vamp Embrace related stuff you can still have issues because whatever is in your saved game has predominance over whatever is in your mod list.

You DO NOT have to re-download VE until the next release.

This post has been edited by Iudas: Sep 6 2004, 06:02 PM